Life Insurance or Retirement fund? (Thread 2)

[artificialstar]

thanks for the advice sis. visitor nga pala ako sa blog mo. very informative.

i have another query. i posted this in the other thread, but mukhang mas active ang thread na to

may whole life insurance po ako. yung face amount nya is 500k. monthly po nito is 1.5k and 20 years to pay. yung sa friend ko, VUL ang kinuha nya. yung face amount is 1M, monthly nya is 2.2k and 10 years to pay lang. and both our plans are until age 85.

parang the same lang yung benefits namin ang difference is parang mas mahal yung insurance ko. akala ko mas mahal pag VUL or hindi good deal ang insurance na nakuha ko? my insurance nga pala is more on protection and may rider na savings. enlighten me mga sis.  tia!

[swit_squiggle]

VULs sis is not a guaranteed plan unlike trads that you have. At the end of 20 years, you are secured na tapos na ang bayarin mo. :-) Yes! VULS are cheaper with higher potential of accumulating fund value compare to trads but we can not say that after 10 years exactly tapos nang magbayad ang friend mo kasi it is link to the stock market/bonds. So it will all depend sa performance ng economy. trads on the other hand since guaranteed you will expect na maliit din lang ang tubo.

[chefron]

Nagback read ako, may napansin akong mga post regarding tax sa insurance..

What are the taxes ba na ibabawas sa insurance claim?
Ang insurance ba talaga eh exempted sa estate tax?

Kase paulit ulit na tanong, iba iba ang sagot 

[freelancer_babe]

What are the taxes ba na ibabawas sa insurance claim?
Ang insurance ba talaga eh exempted sa estate tax?

I've also asked around. This is what I understand.

Pag revocable ang declared na beneficiaries, the proceeds are still subject to estate tax.

Pag irrevocable ang declared na beneficiaries, then dyan pa lang magiging exempt sa estate tax ang proceeds.

[artificialstar]

^^^ thanks sis. Pag na hospitaliza, saan po kukunin yung amount na ibibgay? Sa face amount ng VUL or yung fund value? Pag nag stop ng payment after 10 yrs pero insufficient ang fund, ano po mangyayari sa policy? Possible kaya mag llapse?

[swit_squiggle]

Depende yan sa plan na nakuha mo sis.

In some traditional products, it is deducted to your total proceed at the end of maturity. So kung 1M ang makukuha mo tapos na hospitalize ko for 100 days with 2,000 income benefit, yung makukuha mo na lang is 980,000.

VULs on the other hand, HIB rider is independent. if you put that rider sa plan mo, hindi siya edededuct sa pera mo. total different benefit siya up to a certain day of hospital confinement.

Pag nag stop ng payment after 10 yrs pero insufficient ang fund, ano po mangyayari sa policy? Possible kaya mag llapse?

After 10 years at kinulang, the insurance company will send notice to policyholders na kailangan nilang magdagdag ng payment sis. Anyway, VUL's are flexible plan. aside from your premium, pwede ka naman mag top-up in excess. kasi napupunta naman sa investment portion ng plan e, pang-augment na din sa future expense. 

Possible maglapse?

yes. But as long as merong pera sa policy mo, it wont lapse. because the insurance charge is dependent sa kung anong pera meron ang policy mo sis. kahit 1,000 na lang ang natira you are still insured for another month or two to the amount of your coverage.

[artificialstar]

^ thanks a lot sis. Naiintindihan ko na

[mxherr5]

After 10 years at kinulang, the insurance company will send notice to policyholders na kailangan nilang magdagdag ng payment sis. Anyway, VUL's are flexible plan. aside from your premium, pwede ka naman mag top-up in excess. kasi napupunta naman sa investment portion ng plan e, pang-augment na din sa future expense. 

Back when I was thinking about getting one of Sunlife's limited pay VUL policies,
I asked this question but neither my agent nor Sunlife's customer care rep could
give me a straight answer hehe.

Maybe you could? 

If the above scenario happens, and the policy holder is COMPELLED to inject funds
into his/her VUL policy lest the policy lapse. Would Sunlife levy a top-up charge?

[swit_squiggle]

Haha! Hindi yun natackle during the training. Since you asked that pati ako napuzzle.

If we base it in the proposal. Yes! Kasi it is mentioned that in exceed of the premium, top-up will be charged by 5% e. Furthermore the policyholder, agrees on bearing the risk when he/she purchased the said plan. We'll.. that's my interpretation lang. 

If we try to take a closer look at it, if you are religiously paying the premium, the possibility na maglapse ang policy on the tenth year is far from reality. Yes! It may fall short because of the charges that it might not reach the 88th year of maturity, but, it will not lapse in a month or two, unless, you withdraw earlier and left a small portion of the fund value.

Sa first two years siguro ng policy mxherr and you entered the market sa napakataas na NAVPU and whew! nagsuper baba the next few months. haha! Ikaw na siguro ang pinakamalas na tao na sa tuwing pasok ng pera sa VUL mataas ang NAVPU tapos biglang bababa. 

[mxherr5]

VULs are complicated little beasts aren't they hehe.

Actually, this nearly happened on my first policy
which I got late 2007. I paid off the annual premium
and placed it in the balanced fund.

As you know, the global financial crisis struck in year
2008 and my fund value was nearly depleted!

I did an excel spreadsheet and saw that if I had
placed it in the equity fund, I would have had to
top-up to keep the policy from lapsing..

But you do have a point.
When I got this VUL, I knew I would take on any
market risk so if the fund value dipped, I would
have to inject funds thru the only method available
to me, i.e. top-ups

[swit_squiggle]

Yes they are. 

Never thought that my sample illustration fits perfectly sa nangyari sa iyo. Ooops. sakit!

Kung may ESP lang sana on stock behaviour, you could have transferred it to bond fund. hehe. yun nga, di natin alam ang market e. hehe. Experience is the best teacher ika nga.

[wifey]

hi mga sis, share ko lang: me & my hubby are about to get insurance+VUL policy sa PruLife UK, nag-agent kasi ang sister ko and it's so convenient for me kasi madali namin maadjust ang policy according sa Fund Value (retirement fund) and Sum Assured/Face Amount na desired namin based sa annual premium na kaya namin icash-out for 10years.

So far eto yung nagenerate namin na plan na balak naming kunin:

Age: 35
Annual Premium: 60k (5k/month) for 10years
Sum Assured/Face Amount: 500,000 (until age 100)

Fund Value: 3.7M+ after 30years -pwedeng iwithdraw nang mas maaga at pwede rin iextend pa para mas tumubo pa. If hindi maclaim while living, it will be added sa Sum Assured for the beneficiary
NOTE: Depends sa market performance , this one is computed @ 10% interest per year

Plus may mga riders pa na 3k/day Hospital Income, Total Disability Benefit and Critical Illness Benefit.

[newstyle]

I had mine for the same price. Parang Flexilink ata ang name nun. Mine is also projected na matatapos for 10 years with 1M Life Insurance, Disability, yung included pati ang mga sakit like stroke and cancer, marami pa, tapos may hospitalization income din for every day of confinement and also additional accident death. Lumalabas na mga 4.5M ang makukuha namin by age 65 if the market goes well like 10% ata yun.

Sa kakabasa ko dito, parang ang mga VUL naman ay pwede siyang macostumize the way you want it.

[mxherr5]

Maxilink ata yan... Flexilink is a pay up to age 88 although
you can opt to pay for however long you want. Maxilink ang
designed to be paid in 5/10 years.

[wifey]

me and my hubby changed our minds again ...will adjust our Sum Assured to 1M, and will remove the Hospital Income Rider kasi nung nagcompute kame ng sister/agent ko, parang namamahalan ako sa 12k/yr na additional premium for this (3k/day HI), tapos we learned na maraming exclusions sa pag-claim ng Hospital Income

Kaya mga sis, we need to check din talaga restrictions & claim procedure. Some agents kasi don't discuss this thoroughly.

In lieu of HI, we are planning to get Insular Health Care Privilege Plus Card (899/yr) while scouting for a more comprehensive Health Insurance (not HMO), baka may masasuggest kayo?

eto yung link ng Privilege Plus Card (discount sya sa PF ng accredited physicians ng Insular Care)
http://www.insularhealthcare.com.ph/ourproducts/privilege-plus-card/

Ano sa tingin nyo mga sis? Your inputs are highly appreciated

[mxherr5]

I was going to say the same thing but got lazy lol.

But seriously 12k per year ang HI rider nila for 3k/day benefit?
Whoa, I thought those riders costs around 2k-3k only?

But I agree with you, what are the chances that you're
going to need that kind of cover?
The only scenario in which it pays to have that cover
is when you are hospitalized for a very long long time..

And even though you probably won't need 3k per day.
You'd need a big sum, right NOW to pay for the bills...

The premium to benefit ratio is so skewed that its not
worth getting an HI.

Insurance companies do offer a "cousin" of HI.
Its almost the same but basically you get your premiums
back and there's a lifetime health fund so to speak.

Insular,manulife and philam life has such products.
Insular I Heal, Manulife Health Plus and Philam Health 100

basically, you get around 1k-2k per day, double the
amount if ICU, double the amount if its caused by a critical
illness and these are the benefits which aren't included in
the regular HI riders. Physician/surgeon fees, yung iba may
ambulance cover pa, may benefit for medicine, then you
get your premiums back. Coverage is good until age 100.

Don't quote me on those benefits though, I just typed those
off the top of my head but they're close enough.

You're in your 30's, I'm mid 20s so I don't know what
kind of premiums you'd be quoted but hindi magkalayo
ang premiums ng tatlo, ranges from 12k-14k per year,
payable for 20 years for a 1M policy.

But I personally don't see any value in this kind of product.
Maybe you might? 

[little_princess]

i have sunlife VUL but my agent resigned na. is there a way that i can take a peak on how my policy is going? i just want to know IF i pull out now, how much will I get vs the total amount that i have paid since i started it.

also, since I have VUL na, is it adviseable to get life insurance pa? just want to secure myself

[wifey]

^^thanks sis mxherr5 for your reply, yes 12k/yr for HI of 3k/day til age 65 + the hassle of claim procedure for me is not worth it so we are definitely scrapping this rider.

Yung mga namention mo na Health Products ng Manulife, Philam & Insular ang pinag-aaralan ko ngayon kaya baka meron sa mga sis natin ang kumuha ng ganitong product and would recommend it.
Both me & hubby are unemployed kasi (former OFWs) kaya wala kameng medical insurance from employer, eto na lang kasi yung aspect na gusto namin isecure na wala pa kame kasi Health is Wealth talaga +peace of mind, based on experience yan sa father ko...we're thinking long-term & at our age feeling ko medyo late na ngayon lang namin sya mabibgyan ng pansin, sayang mas mababa pa sana premium nung bata bata pa hehe..

[mxherr5]

If you are interested, I suggest taking a look at Manulife
first. They have the most comprehensive and "benefit-y(?)"
plan hehe in other words, mas marami silang benefits

Here's a snapshot based on a 1M policy

Daily Hospitalization Income (DHI) 1,250.00

Dread Disease Hospitalization Income (DDHI) 1,250.00

Long-Term Hospitalization Income (LTHI) 1,250.00

Intensive Care Unit Income (ICUI) 1,250.00

Surgical Allowance Benefit (SAB) Max of 50,000.00

Outpatient Consultation Benefit (OCB) Max of 500.00

Prescription Drug Benefit (PDB) Max of 500.00

Auto-Increase in LIL (AIL) starting age 60 500,000.00

Ambulance Allowance Benefit (AAB) -

Long Life Bonus Remaining LIL or Php 50,000.00,
whichever is lower(age 70)

Maturity Benefit Remaining LIL or actual premiums
paid for the basic plan, whichever is
lower(100)

Death Benefit Remaining LIL or actual premiums
paid for the basic plan, whichever is
lower

So basically, you're covered until age 100
and you get your premiums back when you
die or when you reach age 100.

[swit_squiggle]

Actually I'm on hunt for a good long term health care insurance Mxherr which most HMO dont have kasi hanggang 65 lang ang coverage nila. I've been eying for Manulife's Adam and Eve. One for my husband and I. Comparing this among whole life Plans, its just somehow the same with a little bit of tweaks. I'm hearing a lot about Kaiser Plan. Any idea? Maybe you can recommend something?